English Thread

[ratlady]

Is "belonging" more used for material things?

ooh-ooh... now, how to explain? I suspect there's some detailed grammatical explanation involving the use of nouns, verbs, adverbs, and adjectives as well as their respective role in a sentence etc... Let's just say that as a general rule, there's (almost) always a "to" belonging to "[to] belong to" (sorry, couldn't resist  )... if you said "and the progressive forms belonging to those verbs", that should be OK (at least in everyday life)
 

btw: The missing "n" in "an" in this case was more a "mistype" than an unknowingness. Usually I use that correct

Actually, you did!  Classic case of cyberspace-misunderstanding - I used the bold print to put a "virtual acoustic emphasis" on "an"... your "a" didn't miss a thing, really.    Sorry, but I really didn't know how else to do it... 




(...your last word should be "correctly", though...    )

[Smartmatze]

Thanks for your explanation... this means I only can have "American accent" but not "an American accent"? Did I understand that right this time?

For the adverbs... I fear I will never really learn the reasons when to use them

Good night

[Floriana]

Hi,

Thanks for your explanation... this means I only can have "American accent" but not "an American accent"? Did I understand that right this time?

no, you didn't. You have "an American accent". I think ratlady wanted to point out that the indefinite article "a" needs an "n" added when it precedes words starting with a vowel.

For the adverbs... I fear I will never really learn the reasons when to use them

It really is quite simple. Adverbs modify verbs, and they tell you how something is done.

Floriana

[OWL]

For the adverbs... I fear I will never really learn the reasons when to use them

A nice song by Tom Lehrer about adverbs:

[ratlady]

Thanks for your explanation... this means I only can have "American accent" but not "an American accent"? Did I understand that right this time?

  I guess I'm really having difficulties expressing myself correctly (no pun intended)...

Of course you can have "an American accent"... when you're talking in your native language (in this case, German). When it comes to English, there's about half a gazillion "accents" out there... thus, no such thing as an "American accent". The emphasis on "an" was meant to indicate that "the American accent" is a generalization that doesn't really exist within the country itself (Wish I had known this was going to turn out that complicated...  But hey, sometimes these things do come back to you - my fault, I apologize.  )

By the way, it's hard (or impossible?) for one to "hear" one's own "accent" anyway... 

[Floriana]

Hi,

I guess I'm really having difficulties expressing myself correctly (no pun intended)...

no, not really. I just completely misunderstood you. Sorry about that. 

Floriana

[dschlei]

By the way, it's hard (or impossible?) for one to "hear" one's own "accent" anyway... 

That is absolutely correct!  After living here for about 30 years, I feel that I have no German accent left.  However, my son and my wife tell me all the time that i really have a heavy German accent!  Other people can detect an accent, but it is so watered down but now that they cannot pinpoint it to a specific country.  For them. I just sound "foreign".

My wife, a linguist, says that she can always hear, whether one was raised in the US or not.  Unless one underwent real rigorous accent reduction training, one will always have some kind of accent that does not sound native!

It could be that the above poster has less of a British sounding accent if he talks to an American, but as you said, an American accent as such is not existing, it is rather a more typical general  American way to pronounce certain words and letters (the r comes to mind here).

[Smartmatze]

Ah, okay, now I understood.
You meant, I cannot say there is ONE "American accent"... as I wrote this, I just meant: I can pronounce the "th" as a "th" (and not as a "s"), the "r" with the tongue up in roof of the mouth and so on... of course for an American, I will easily be recognized as a foreign speaker, but I don't make the "typical German pronounciation mistakes"...

That's all I wanted to say in my first posting...  didn't expect that would get such a big thing

Good night
Matze (have you ever tried to tell this name to an American? ).

P.S.: I remember I saw a German family on the TV who named their child "Kenneth". But they weren't able to pronounce the child's name correctly (btw: correct use of adverb?!?), they always called him "Kennes"...  (ouch!)

[Floriana]

Hi,

P.S.: I remember I saw a German family on the TV who named their child "Kenneth". But they weren't able to pronounce the child's name correctly (btw: correct use of adverb?!?), they always called him "Kennes"...  (ouch!)

yes, correct. You catch on quickly! 

"Kennes"? This somehow reminds me of "Schakke-line" and "Schan-talle" and "Bädd-rigg" (Southern Germany).

Floriana

[ratlady]

I can pronounce the "th" as a "th" (and not as a "s")

You can - or you think you can?  - there's apparently a lot more to a "th" than just "not an s"... just ask wikipedia... 

(don't take it personally, I'm in there with you... every day...  )

Some other "typical" mistakes, by the way - "v" and "w" (among my personal "favorites"  ), and where to put the emphasis in words with more than one syllable... Sometimes, you can end up focusing so much on one or two "typical mistakes" that most of the countless others get totally out of control...   

Typical conversation at home:
I: "could you please get me [*such-and-such*]?"
Hubby: "Huh?"
I: "[*such-and-such*]
Hubby: "What???"
I: "that thing, you know, [*detailed explanation*]"
Hubby: "Oh, you mean [*such-and-such*], why didn't you say so?"
I: "THAT IS!!!! EXACTLY WHAT I SAID!"
Hubby: "No, you said..." (AAARRGHHH!!!)

That's all I wanted to say in my first posting...  didn't expect that would get such a big thing

I know exactly how you feel... 

(BTW - a "typical spelling mistake"... pronunciation... pronounced just like that, too  )

[Elmo]

Seems this topic is immortal. 

I can pronounce the "th" as a "th" (and not as a "s"),

Well, as I figure, there are many different pronunciations for "th".

something: sounds more like an "f"
this: sometimes sounds like an "d"
etc.

But maybe we should give this topic a rest since we must be discussing it for the millionth time right now..

Anyway, SanFrancisco asked how we practice. Fortunately, my employer finances a Business English Certificate (Cambridge) and that´s where I get my training from besides my learning the "regular" English.
Business English is often considered another language and I can agree insofar as you have typical phrases that are commonly used in commercial correspondence. But that is also what I hate about this kind of language. You are quite limited in choosing your words and phrases and you are not free to write more creatively.
I always get a little bit upset when I write a letter and my trainer says that those terms are not necessarily wrong, but are not entirely right in terms of business language either.

[SanFrancisco]

@dschlei: See? That is why we have to practise English    I´m always very happy to have someone who tells me what mistakes I make - because I don´t often realize it myself!

@elmo: That´s great! I would also love to take Business English lessons - some people in my company do even get them - but not me! So the only thing I can do is to watch movies, read books, and write e-Mails with a friend in Minnesota. She is very nice and keeps on telling me that my english is pretty good 

I also have an american friend who lives in the same town as I do, but unfortunately, she seems to think I´m a bit stupid and that I´m not able to understand, read or write english at all. That´s actually a bit disturbing. She never talks english to me - and when she shows me pictures of her little niece or nephew, she keeps on translating the underlines of the pictures for me, which are as difficult as "Little XXX, age 3, on Christmas Eve 2006". Thanks a lot for that!

The last book I read in english, by the way, was "Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows".

[ratlady]

@elmo: That´s great! I would also love to take Business English lessons - some people in my company do even get them - but not me! So the only thing I can do is to watch movies, read books, and write e-Mails with a friend in Minnesota.

...or, make friends with those who do get to enjoy classes in Business English and ask them to practice with you...   

I also have an american friend who lives in the same town as I do, but unfortunately, she seems to think I´m a bit stupid and that I´m not able to understand, read or write english at all. That´s actually a bit disturbing. She never talks english to me - and when she shows me pictures of her little niece or nephew, she keeps on translating the underlines of the pictures for me, which are as difficult as "Little XXX, age 3, on Christmas Eve 2006". Thanks a lot for that!

Don't take it personally  Here, I've occasionally been approached by people who had taken up German at one point in their lives and now were interested in some "practice". Well, for me, that's always kind of a "strange" situation... it's hard to explain, but somehow I have difficulties talking German in an English-speaking environment, especially to someone who speaks English better than German. Kind of a similar feeling as I had back in school during English classes, when I just couldn't get myself to "talk English" in a room full of Germans...  Confusing, I know... 

Anyway, your friend's "unwillingness" to talk English with you may have other reasons that are completely unrelated to yourself and your English skills (as far as I can tell, there's nothing wrong with those  ). Maybe she just likes to talk German better than English; and maybe she isn't actually "translating" but just "talking" about those pictures (I've had that quite often, and also done it myself - tell people what's on the pictures even though it's right there on the paper). Maybe there's still some other reason... 

[SanFrancisco]

Hey, this idea is really good! I think I´ll go and try that, let´s see if it works It´s pretty funny, the reason I´m not allowed to take this english classes is that they think my english is good enough already, and the don´t want to spent money on me getting even better... First, when those lessons started, they were talking about letting me take spanish lessons, which wouldn´t have been too bad either, but unfortunately, the seem to have forgotten about that completely...

The problem is, if she would only talk about the pictures, like you described, I would be perfectly ok with it! But she also keeps on saying stuff like "Ich weiß nicht, ob Du weißt, was das heißt", even if the word is as easy as "Christmas" or "Age XXX". Also, when she shows an e-Mail (jokes or something), she says: "Ich weiß nicht, ob Du so gut Englisch lesen kannst". But she knows that I read a lot of english books, she even  borrowed some from me already! That really annoys me a bit. Maybe you are right and I´m getting it completely wrong, but sometimes I feel like a complete idiot because of that!

I know what you mean with "talking english in a non-english environment". It´s the same with me, if I have to talk english on the phone in the office, I´m really doing a pretty poor job, because I feel so strange speaking english when everybody else around me is speaking german! On vacation in USA e.g., I don´t have any problems with that!

[dschlei]

@elmo: That´s great! I would also love to take Business English lessons - some people in my company do even get them - but not me! So the only thing I can do is to watch movies, read books, and write e-Mails with a friend in Minnesota. She is very nice and keeps on telling me that my english is pretty good 

She might be just acting "Minnesota nice" as we call it around here!  Next time when you write to her, tell her to drop the "Minnesota nice" attitude and tell you the things the way they are!  She’ll know exactly what you mean with Minnesota nice, but she might not want to let go of it if you don’t know her that close!

People around here are very sensitive about other people feelings and don’t want to hurt them (their feelings that is)!